Mormon apologetics have been around ever since Mormonism has existed. Join with Mike, Nemo and John as they discuss the types of apologetics that members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints engage in and why they are all flawed.
LDS Discussions Essay on Apologetics: Overview of Apologetic Responses Within Mormonism
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Show Notes:
- ldsdiscussions.com/apologetics
- Joseph Smith’s Happiness Letter with Nemo the Mormon
- CES Letter
- MormonThink
- Letter for My Wife
- The Backyard Professor
- FAIR Mormon
- Radio Free Mormon
- Dan Vogel
- Brent Metcalfe
- Brian Hauglid
- Fiona Givens
- Terryl Givens
- Kerry Muhlestein FAIR speech
- No Ma’am That’s Not History
- Bart Ehrman on apologetics
Mormon Stories Related
7 Responses
“I don’t believe in a God that will keep me out of heaven over a cup of coffee” is a straw man argument.
Though I doubt you guys will acknowledge it.
How so?
Maven, because it is an oversimplification (and possibly a mischaracterization) of the faithful view on the topic. I don’t hear anyone making the argument that “god will keep you out of heaven over a cup of coffee”. There are a wide range of views on this topic among faithful Mormons. I think the consensus view is much more nuanced than that. And even if there are a few strident voices willing to say “god will keep you out of heaven over a cup of coffee”, y’all representing that view as the majority or official view of the church body creates an easily-vanquished strawman.
Further, D&C 89 itself says nothing about hot drinks preventing entry to heaven (let alone coffee specifically).
It’s not really an oversimplification though. Temple worthy = celestial kingdom worthy.
There’s also this infamous talk that makes it clear:
“Though she knew it was contrary to the Word of Wisdom, she developed the habit of drinking coffee and kept a coffee pot on the back of her stove. She claimed that “the Lord will not keep me out of heaven for a little cup of coffee.” But, because of that little cup of coffee, she could not qualify for a temple recommend, and neither could those of her children who drank coffee with her. Though she lived to a good old age and did eventually qualify to reenter and serve in the temple, only one of her 10 children had a worthy temple marriage, and a great number of her posterity, which is now in its fifth generation, live outside of the blessings of the restored gospel she believed in and her forefathers sacrificed so much for.”
https://www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/general-conference/2007/04/remembering-repenting-and-changing?lang=eng
I tire of the defense that …”we don’t really teach that”.
Good Job Maven.
Can you link the YouTube video Nemo was referring to where he said there was an apologetics video that Nemo responded to that had to be taken down and they tried to get Nemo’s taken down as well?
Hello, I believe that was Nemo’s Fact-Checking series for FAIR’s “This is the show” https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QSpThHZpg7c&list=PL2iZEtQU3lgf1L4XSpCp3AlcIgRoeFsOi&pp=iAQB